logs archiveIRC Archive / Oftc / #tor / 2010 / May / 23 / 1
SwissTorExit
look like their a log but pretty hard to use and it will be devlopped in the futur. i don't have many contact with them since i am sue, but their have my trace
mikeperry
there are a few new posts to their forums still. don't see many admin posts though
SwissTorExit
i was never on forum and it was at the first stage so i have no more clue about the devloppement, but i think quite more bad for the operator while it can have really a clue about his status
your status*
i found bitblinder good for public tracker but not for private like where i am
because can be work with new system on good private tracker , it will not accepted, because a unknow or unaccpted client
brb
keb
polipo is working fine on my lucid upgrade
arma
keb: ok. i think the issue is people who install lucid, change their polipo config, and try to restart polipo.
i wonder if we should be telling them to force-restart rather than restart. i wonder if that works on every polipo deb.
waggle: still working?
waggle
yes
SwissTorExit
well so far i found always more slow on my 4 cores as privoxy, so i still on it, but i sure try few time, i can get why it's mote quick by some of you
waggle
I had a new question
ill post it in nottor
portis
good evening!
is it generelly a good idea to use a server for other things than tor?
for example as backup server for another one?
or webmailer etc?
i ask this especially for security reasons
         

arma
the simplest answer is 'no'
atagar
portis: the only issue is if you're using tor as an exit node (in that case it's best if it's a standalone server with its own ip address for abuse reasons) - beyond that should be fine
portis
ok
arma
for non-exit relays it is very likely to be fine
portis
a whole server just for tor is a lot of money...
i really need to think this over - vserver vs dedicated
nsa
or: arma committed revision 22377 (/website/trunk/en): i hear mike signs the torbutton xpis
arma
portis: is it an exit relay we're talking about?
portis
not yet, its a relay for now
but i'm thinking about a exit
atagar
portis: the reason for the dedicated server for exits is described on https://blog.torproject.org/blog/tips-running-exit-node-minimal-harassment
arma
you can put other stuff on it. just make sure it isn't stuff you will miss if somebody grabs your server for a few months.
atagar
not necessary, but helps :)
portis
i see :)
thanks
my relay is fast enough for a vserver i guess
arma
also in the case of a webmailer, you might not want some cop to be pawing through your users' mails
portis
yeah, you're right. maybe just encrypted backups...
arma
some places have laws about how they can't look through other stuff, or they can't induce downtime on unrelated services,
(i think germany has such laws)
but good luck getting anybody there to admit to them or to follow them
soultcer
I remember one exit node had a notice that said it was also a mail server and that taking it down or looking at the data on it would thus be illegal
arma
yep. wonder how that trick works in practice.
people also make announcements about how you'll owe them $10k for sending them a spam mail.
soultcer
Well for spam mails you never really know who sent it.
But if you get your server taken down you better know who did it.
portis
so if it's better tor only, which would be no problem when it's gone
soultcer
Or tor and some mail server that you don't really use but which might be a legal advantage?
         

portis
i think they would love my emails too
arma
legal tricks based on technology rarely stand up to bureaucracy and grumpy humans
soultcer
Not like it's gonna hurt anyone if you don't rely on the mailserver
But yeah, technological tricks rarely work.
I like to think of the tor-server-combined-with-mailserver as a legal trick though, but what does a low-life programmer understand about legal issues ;-)
arma
i enjoyed reading http://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/blog/paul/being-acquitted-versus-being-searched-yanal (may or may not be relevant here)
portis
as far as i know, german police is allowed to access someones mails in some circumstances
which includes mails on servers outside ones home
soultcer
Hehe I guess with legal stuff it's the same as with crypto: Don't try to implement it yourself, or you will shoot yourself in your foot.
portis
:)
BarkerJr
my hibernating nodes keep showing up in the consensus from time to time
arma
barkerjr: interesting.
BarkerJr
arg, nm, my mistake
arma
oh good
BarkerJr
it actually is running... now that is weird
May 17 03:29:10.041 [warn] Mismatched accounting interval; starting a fresh one.
so something in tor musta gotten confused
arma
barkerjr: your clock got confused perhaps? it looks like your tor woke up and the state file was talking about the next accounting period. (do you use months, weeks, days?)
BarkerJr
months
arma
so your state file said it was accounting for june, but your tor thought is was may,
or your state file said may, and your tor thought it was april? hm
BarkerJr
hmm
I wouldn't think so. unless my host messed something up
arma
see configure_accounting() in hibernate.c
can you look at the state file and see what interval it says it's using?
it would be even better to see a copy of the state file before you started that tor
BarkerJr
this is what I have now: AccountingIntervalStart 2010-05-01 00:00:00
nsa
or: mikeperry committed revision 22378 (/torctl/trunk/python/TorCtl):
or: Alter launch_thread() to return the EventHandler thread, as
or: this provides a more reliable indication as to when we are
or: done processing events on the connection.
or: For some reason python's socket.close() does not cause a
arma
makes sense. wonder what you had before.
seems like maybe you had 2010-06-01.
BarkerJr
I'll see if I have backups
waggle
im trying to set up this tor sasl thing on freenode. getting very frustrated. can anyone help?
BarkerJr
arma: it was AccountingIntervalStart 2010-05-01 04:00:00
waggle
arma, may I ask what you were referring to when you said "legal tricks based on technology rarely stand up to bureaucracy and grumpy humans"
BarkerJr
I guess my timezone changed
I'll post a bug
arma
barkerjr: interesting!
waggle: the url i posted above
BarkerJr
it shouldn't be that sensetive I think :)
Sebastian_
BarkerJr: woah
arma
woah?
Sebastian_
arma: if that is true, that's a pretty big bug.
arma
change your timezone, reset your accounting counts?
i guess so
Sebastian_
Is there a security reason why we don't log what it was before?
arma
nope. just nick didn't bother making the log line more complex.
Sebastian_
right
arma
wonder how many people have encountered this bug.
Sebastian_
(Action) makes it so
Did anyone reproduce it?
arma
not i. but it makes sense, if your state file starts out that way.
i guess the question is, why is the state file not using absolute times.
that is, gmt
Sebastian_
mine is using gmt.
arma
barkerjr: do you know what version of tor wrote the one with the offset?
Sebastian_
I started a Tor just a few minutes ago, and it put this: AccountingIntervalStart 2010-05-22 22:00:00
BarkerJr
well, it is using gmt... my server was set to gmt -4, then I changed it to gmt
Sebastian_
I guess that isn't gmt either
I'm in gmt + 2
BarkerJr
this is a new (8 days old) relay that has only run 0.2.2.13-alpha
arma
barkerjr: is it possible your time zone was wrong, but your time was right?
(meaning your time was wrong once you adjust for time zone)
BarkerJr
I didn't reboot if that's what you mean
all I did was update /etc/timezone
maybe C++ caches timezone?
Sebastian_
hm I'm just slow.
of course it is gmt.
(in my case.)
BarkerJr: Tor internally should always use gmt
BarkerJr: so the only way to trigger that would be to change the actual gmt time
BarkerJr
the problem is that the default accounting is using local time
the default is monthly on day 1 00:00 local time
Sebastian_
right
but Tor saves that into your state file as a gmt time
BarkerJr
right, and day 1 00:00 EST == day 1 04:00
then I change the system to gmt and it == day 1 00:00
Sebastian_
ah. I think I understand now.
hrm.
Not that I can reproduce.
ah
it seems that we need to have it running for at least one full accounting period.
arma
does it write a different timestamp-for-beginning-of-interval when it's been running vs when it picks a new one?
Sebastian_
May 23 02:10:59.034 [warn] Unrecognized accounting unit 'minute': only 'month', 'week', and 'day' are supported.
:/
arma
heh.
Sebastian_
hard to reproduce.
;)
arma
sebastian: i just edited https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/TheOnionRouter/TorifyHOWTO/WebBrowsers. does mail / notification here no longer happen?
Sebastian_
I think it doesn't. I never knew there was mail notification for the wiki. I'm not the right person to talk to wrt to trac stuff though, I have neither access nor clue. helix might know more
arma
ok
Sebastian_
(it hasn't ever done email notifications on wiki editing)
but that's the only thing I know for sure :)
(it == trac)
waggle
arggh
can someone please help with tor sasl
krit
if i have two machines on my network, can i make one machine use the tor client of another machine ? I tried simply putting instead of 127.0.0.1, lan_ip but it doesn't work
Sebastian_
krit: by default, Tor only listens on localhost
You will want to change the SocksListenAddress config option, or (better!) use ssh forwarding.
arma
krit: are you using polipo or privoxy in the loop too? if so, where is that running?
Sebastian_
waggle: You might have better luck if you tell people what you actually want to do, what kind of instructions you already found and how they are failing.
waggle
I would like to connect to freenode using their "tor-sasl" method. I've followed the instructions on their blog in the link that follows and have setup tor to connect through a proxy. When I try to connect on irssi it immediately gives the error "Irssi: Unable to connect server p4fsi4ockecnea7l.onion
port 6667 [Name or service not known]"
http://blog.freenode.net/2010/01/connecting-to-freenode-using-tor-sasl/
Sebastian_
that sounds like your irssi might not be successfully torified
waggle
forgot about that. why do these jerks purposely leave out 90% of the configuring and setup that you have to go though?
Sebastian_, so, once I torify it, should I turn the proxy off?
Sebastian_
the proxy?
waggle
i have the proxy set up as tor
Sebastian_
I'm not sure what you mean exactly.
Also, the freenode blog isn't loading here ;?
:/
waggle
I have irssi setup to connect through tor
as a proxy
Sebastian_
maybe your dns doesn't go through Tor.
waggle
ie. I haven't torrified it
when?
krit
arma : i am using privoxy, both tor and privoxy run on machine A i want to use it on Machine B without installing
Sebastian_
krit: ah, so you want to use the privoxy on machine a?
then you don't have to change Tor's config, but privoxy's.
krit
yes
ok
waggle
when does "maybe your dns doesn't go through Tor."?
krit
i am searching how to, actually i want to use tor also not just privoxy, looking up the variable name you gave me
it says i have to specify the port
Sebastian_
krit: you don't have to change that config option of Tor
krit
if i use socks 5
Sebastian_
krit: because privoxy already connects to Tor on machine a
krit
ok, i got that for privoxy
but what if i want to use tor without privoxy :
SocksListenAddress 192.168.0.10:9050 ?
that's the ip of the other machine
waggle
how do you correctly torify irssi? is it just "torify irssi"?
I have a general question
nevermind
Sebastian_, are you there?
arma
krit: if you do that, your tor won't listen on localhost, so the privoxy on localhost won't be able to talk to it.
krit
arma: ok, so another line wit 127.0.0.1 should do correct ?
arma
sure
or you can just listen on 0.0.0.0 if you want to specify both
but make sure the outside world can't reach that computer, or you'll have random people in russia using your tor client
krit
ok
thanks bye
waggle
arma, do you know much about this?
Sebastian_
waggle: we have a section of our faq dedicated to that
let me see if I can find it in our new wiki -.-
https://trac.torproject.org/projects/tor/wiki/TheOnionRouter/TorifyHOWTO/IrcSilc
there
krit
SocksListenAddress 192.168.0.10
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