logs archiveIRC Archive / Oftc / #tor / 2010 / April / 18 / 1
zhxk
but tor users have to send encryped data to tor network and give tor network to decript the data at the end of the chain to let the target server read it
enki
anyone have any good PET-related RSS feeds they'd like to recommend?
zhxk
its tor that encrypt the data, and its also tor that decrypt the data,right?
misc
zhxk: yes, that's also covered on the website, tor do not protect the traffic if not encrypted
zhxk
and only you owns the server which do the decryption
no, its not convered to the website
Sebastian
zhxk: not true
the exit nodes aren't owned by Tor.
They are all over the world.
zhxk
its converted at the exit to the tor chain
misc
zhxk: I tought you couldn't access the website to read it ?
zhxk
im reading, but there seems no information about that?
         

Runa
zhxk: anyone can run a relay.
zhxk
that means anyone can have a part of the information you sent?
Runa
zhxk: no, because it's encrypted.
zhxk: please read the information on the website, it's all covered there.
zhxk
the webserver only read the decryped message
misc
and the exit node
unless you use a secured protocol, in which case only the webserver can read it
zhxk
i know all data have to go at least through one server that owns by tor group.
misc
tor group ?
Sebastian
zhxk: that's not true.
zhxk
tor orgnization?
Sebastian
Also, tor doesn't own any Tor relays.
zhxk
well, people only send the most sensitive information through tor bacause they believe its secure. there is a chinese saying "there has no money here, dont dig down"
misc
some people send everything through tor because they know it generate traffic to hide others
zhxk
"there have no money about 300billion here, dont dig down"
RebornRevan
this is the help channel for TOR right?
misc
somebelieve everything they send is sensitive by nature ( like ip address )
Runa
RebornRevan: correct
misc
Runa: yes
argh
Runa
;)
RebornRevan
why does it slow me down so bad that i loss 100% connection to my browser, but non proxy apps work?
SwissTorExit
RebornRevan: while sure wrong set up
lol
         

RebornRevan
how would i set it up properly? --> default is current confg <--
SwissTorExit
maybe be more precise if you want help :D
RebornRevan
well, when i click 'Tor Disabled' and it activates it, i cant browse at all. and its using relays across the sea (Euro etc. im from USA)
Runa
RebornRevan: which os and which version?
RebornRevan
most recent version, Windows 7 x64
Runa
zhxk: we do try to educate people on how to browse the web safely using tor
misc
RebornRevan: well, using relay from all over the world is the principal of tor
zhxk
Runa:i dont know if you can unserstand the chinese saying
RebornRevan
when i activate tor, my browser slows down so bad, it takes 45mins to 1hour, just to fully load 1 page.
Runa
zhxk: which saying? don't dig down?
zhxk
"there is no gold about 300kilo under the ground, dont dig down,please"
Runa
zhxk: no, I don't understand that
peh_
that's one weird fortune cookie
zhxk
"there is no gold about 300kilo just under the ground, dont dig down,please"
Sebastian
Just repeating yourself won't help anyone.
RebornRevan
how do i set TOR up, or properly configure it, so i can use my 8MBPS, 4MBPS as a relay(already done), and the other 4 for browsing?(so its not so slow)
Sebastian
I don't think us understanding the saying will help you understand Tor.
phobos
RebornRevan: https://www.torproject.org/faq#WhySlow
Sebastian
RebornRevan: Unfortunately, running Tor as a client as well as a relay at the same time often means the client part gets slowed down
RebornRevan: There is some bandwidth limiting options that can help you.
You can set RelayBandwidthRate to what you want for your relay
and BandwidthRate to what you want for your relay + client.
RebornRevan
ok, thanks for that link, im reading it right now
Francis
RebornRevan, is 45 minutes an exaggeration, or does it really take that long?
zhxk
Sebastian:you read the saying carefully "there is no gold about 300kilo right under the ground, dont dig down at this place,please"
RebornRevan
it really takes me that long, i timed it.. and waited
Sebastian
zhxk: I don't care about your saying. Not at all. Please stop repeating it.
Runa
zhxk: we don't understand it
RebornRevan
he is saying it in a sarcastic way "Please, dont dig down" he wants you to dig, so you can find his gold.
zhxk
Runa:its the treasure hidder lies others about his treasure
darrob
zhxk: how does that chengyu go in chinese?
Sebastian
RebornRevan: right, but that has no relevance to Tor.
zhxk
hidden palce
Runa
zhxk: it is not relevant to tor
zhxk: you can move to #nottor if you want to talk about it further
RebornRevan
if i misconfigure firefox(reconfiguring it for TOR) will it break, and require a reinstall if i dont do it properly?
Sebastian
RebornRevan: you don't really need to configure it at all. Just install Torbutton
Then you can toggle Tor on and off
no further config required.
uninstall Torbutton, and stuff is like it was before.
RebornRevan
its installed, but like i said earlier, it takes 45mins to 1hour to load a single webpage
Sebastian
Right, that's obviously not normal, and Tor is much faster than that. What we'd need to know is more info about your setup, so we can help track the problem down.
zhxk
RebornRevan:he wont you to dig, but he was a bit nervers.A guilty person gives himself away by consciously protesting his innocence.
RebornRevan
ok, list the info you need, ill find it
Runa
zhxk: it's not relevant to tor, so please stop talking about the chinese saying here
RebornRevan: what you changed is a good start :)
Sebastian
RebornRevan: well, like I said, your setup
RebornRevan
ok give me a min to list what i changed.
Sebastian
Which package did you install?
Did you have Tor working before, with sane speeds?
How are you configuring your relay? What is the name/identity?
RebornRevan
no, i just installed it around 4pm yesterday, and didnt try it till today.
it has all the default configurations except the 'relay'
ok i have it set to, "Relay traffic for the tor network", Basic Settings Nickname: Revan Contact Info: revan@truebloodgaming.co.cc Relay port: 443 (yes its port forwarded) (Checked) Mirror Relay Directory port: 9030
Francis
hey katmagic
RebornRevan
bandwith is limited to Cable/DSL 768 Kbps (i have a total of 8MPBS), Exit Policies are: Website, Website(Secure)
katmagic
Oh, hi.
zhxk
Runa:but the fact is the same: people trys to keep safty by using tor for sending messages, and tor makers pick the messages from tor relays which relays the sensitive messages
Sebastian
RebornRevan: ok, do you have symmetric up/downstream?
RebornRevan
symmetric?
katmagic
Did you get your programs isolated?
Francis
Would anyone be able to tell me how to make sure all Firefox addons go through Tor?
No
Sebastian
RebornRevan: same amount of upstream and downstream
RebornRevan: you'll also want to disable your dirport.
(don't mirror the directory)
katmagic
OK. You'll need to isolate the Firefox process so it isn't able to access anything other than 127.0.0.1:9050.
Francis
katmagic, Ok, great. How do you do that?
RebornRevan
i have a 4MPBS(i said 4 because my ISP uses 8, but i have my router limiting us to 4) download, and a 8MBPS upload
katmagic
You're on Linux?
Francis
Yes.
Sebastian
RebornRevan: ok great.
misc
using tor directly from webkit as socks proxy should work, no ?
Sebastian
arma: see a relay "Revan" trying to get into the consensus?
Francis
webkit?
katmagic
OK. So you'll want to create a new, unprivileged user to run Firefox.
zhxk
Runa:is very efficent to get most valuable information from this "fishing way", right?
Francis
A new Ubuntu user? Non-sudo?
katmagic
So you'll want to run `sudo adduser tor-firefox`.
misc
Francis: a html rendering engine, used by epiphany, safari
but in fact, that's right, epiphany use gio for network related interaction, not webkit
Francis
katmagic, running that now...
RebornRevan
Oh, when i use the bandwidth graph in TOR, it says im only receiving 100KBPS or less, and i sent a few hundred.
Francis
It's asking me to enter a new Unix Password.
Sebastian
RebornRevan: right, you're probably overloading your relay
with new connection attempts
RebornRevan
how do i not 'overload' it then?
Sebastian
so please close your dirport, and possibly limit your bandwidth some more for the beginning.
Then slowly go up.
Francis
I'm assuming this is for the new user but I'd like to play it safe and confirm it with you katmagic
RebornRevan
ok, give me a min
im gonna probably loss IRC connection (gonna reenable TOR)
katmagic
Enter whatever, it doesn't matter.
Francis
ok
misc
do people know http://perfect-privacy.com/ ? it seems they are running several tor nodes ( at least 6 of the peer of my relay have a reverse for them )
Sebastian
no problem, I'll be here. Don't expect an immediate effect, though.
It takes a few hours to propagate.
RebornRevan
ok, so should i just change it, not enable TOR (in browser) and keep playing or w/e and then check a few hours later?
Francis
ok katmagic done : )
what next?
misc
mhh their faq do not speak at all of tor :/
Francis
katmagic, are you occupied?
katmagic
I've just want to check the man page so I don't give you the wrong command and ruin your system. :-)
RebornRevan
should i enable the port's manually into my router? or, let it use UPnP forwarding?
Francis
ok
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
Francis sounds too sissy
ilter1
Hello everyone. I'd like to ask question about clipped bw. Afaik relay bw's can be 10MBps max. But blutmagie bw's is nearly 14MBps. How is it possible?
katmagic
Run `sudo visudo` and add '%admin ALL=(ALL) /usr/bin/firefox'.
Err, '%admin ALL=(tor-firefox) /usr/bin/firefox'.
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
katmagic, before we continue, will this allow me to run Tor through a VPN
katmagic
No, it'll make a user account that can only access 127.0.0.1:9050.
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
damn
katmagic, what if I run that account through OpenVPN set up on my router?
Sebastian
ilter1: that used to be the case
it isn't anymore.
Is that still in the spec?
If so, please file a bug.
ilter1
(Action) looks
katmagic
tor?
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
yes the tor user
RebornRevan
in the relay ya i saw blutmagie as 14MBps my self.
katmagic
OK, is the VPN transparent, or do you need to connect to a specific proxy?
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
I connect to a proxy; it is a proxy as well as a VPN
ilter1
Sebastian: Yes path-spec says that it's still 10MBps .@85: "MAX_BELIEVABLE_BANDWIDTH (currently 10 MB/s) .. "
katmagic
What protocol does it use, and what port?
RebornRevan
it took me around 20mins to load, bing.com
Sebastian
ilter1: please file a bug?
ilter1
Sebastian: Ok i'm going to file it.
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
UDP I believe; 1143
Sebastian
tada, thanks.
ilter1
Sebastian: Meanwhile when was it changed?
Sebastian
a few months back
katmagic
Is it an HTTP proxy, SOCKS?
ilter1
Sebastian: Do you know in which version?
Sebastian
ilter1: let me check
ilter1
(Action) thanks to Sebastian
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
its an OpenVPN proxy. All traffic is routed through the VPN and I get my IP from the VPN for _all_ traffic.
Sebastian
ilter1: 0.2.1.17-rc
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
katmagic, I'll just follow what you say and we can see what happens
katmagic
So it's transparent (i.e. you do not need to configure applications to use it)?
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
katmagic, no I don't need to configure any applications. I just connect and it's done.
RebornRevan
Sebastian, is there a way i can make a specific relay i use? (if so, would that speed up TOR?)
Sebastian
RebornRevan: I don't quite understand the question
katmagic
OK, so Tor would go through that anyway.
ilter1
Sebastian: Thank you i'm looking it. Then did you out any new value for MAX_BELIEVABLE_BANDW1DTH ?
Sebastian
ilter1: no I think that value is simply ignored now
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
ok
RebornRevan
is there a way i can choose a 'specific' relay that TOR will choose no matter what? and if so.. "WOULD" that have any effect of speeding TOR up?
Sebastian
well, Tor will always use three relays for data
you can choose the first and last
but the problems you're having are about using it as a relay
you might want to stop relaying for 8 hours
and then start again
without being a directory mirror
and with less bandwidth to start out.
katmagic
You can choose specific relays for entry and exit, and you can choose your whole path if you want to do evil magic with the controller.
(These are all likely bad ideas.)
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
katmagic, would you please continue
Sebastian
There, /me needs to clean the kitchen and get some sleep.
back later.
HEAPBIGWARRIOR
I will try to follow your instructions as fast as possible.
RebornRevan
well, under the relay tab, it say i have like 8+ connections "open"
Sebastian
RebornRevan: those are client connections
RebornRevan
ohh, people 'using' me?
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