logs archiveIRC Archive / Freenode / #oracle / 2010 / May / 23 / 1
epicurus
I need advice... I think I want to become a dba specialist, right now my plan is to get oracle certified as linux admin and OCA, and maybe whatever the SQL Server entry cert is... then I want to get into ecommerce management
any comments/advice is appreciated.. .does this sound like a good idea
RJarett
"dba specialist"? eh
epicurus
yeah, meaning i don't want to wear ten different hats
RJarett
sounds like youll have absolutely no clue how to do your job even after all that
epicurus
how do you know?
RJarett
A real dba still needs to wear all the hats, since we have to be masters of the system it runs on, the storage, and the apps that run it
epicurus
i include that in dba
RJarett
epicurus: because for the last 13 years ive dealt w/ many people who think certs make them skilled
epicurus
i don't think that though
where did you get started, were you born with 13 yrs of exp?
         

RJarett
oca is pretty much just saying you have the skill to buy an oracle book
no more
not that you even read it
I started using it.
It was pre-google
pre-altavista
epicurus
what good is using it without a job
RJarett
No easy access. No java based installer
epicurus
did you store your recipes?
RJarett
Back when it took skill
Nope, 80gb of video and photos
which back then was alot
epicurus
sounds boring
you learned something from that?
RJarett
youre a fu*king moron
how do you expect to learn?
Yes I learned much.
epicurus
so i shouldnt read books? just fumble around with my media library?
RJarett
build a major project, destroy it, try to recreate it and recover it
epicurus
seems like you're the fu*king moron, really
thats not a major project, thats fu*king around
RJarett
nope, im saying if you think oca will make you skilled or teach you how to use it, you are very mistaken
epicurus: actually back then that was larger than most databases at fortune 500 companies
epicurus
so what? the question is what did you do with it
having a full hard drive is not impressive
RJarett
Tested my skills of recovery, performance tuning
lol
full harddrive
an array of a few dozen drives
Your knowledge of computer history is fail.
epicurus
i was working in multi million dollar nocs while you were fu*king around in your bedroom
you fu*king moron
fu*k you
RJarett
Actually considering I work working FOR oracle 12 years ago, and writing for wrox publishing about intermedia/context 11 years ago, i think it did well for me
epicurus
i'm trying to get back in the game, i don't need your smartass remarks, you cunt
RJarett
s/was working
epicurus
so you worked for oracle by fu*king around in your bedroom with your porn collection?
and you wrote books about that? but books don't teach anything?
RJarett
You think a business will let you test disaster recovery on a production system?
epicurus
you're a di*khead, arent; you?
just shut the fu*k up
         

RJarett
If you want to "get back in the game", think of a project. Design and deploy it end to end.
Destroy it
and try to recover it
Youll learn more than some retarded OCA book will teach you
epicurus
ok, thanks, you finally offered something useful
but that won't get me a job
RJarett
What the fu*k do you think I said before dipsh*t?
same thing
I think ITT is more your speed
Or Devry
epicurus
i already have a degree from a tier one university, thanks
RJarett
Go get a "ecommerce" cert
epicurus
you assume too much
telling people i created and destroyed and recreated a database is not going to get me a job
RJarett
Actually it would
epicurus
this is 2010
RJarett
Master rman, or other forms of DR and you are in
Any stupid fu*k can run a database in day to day work. hell with OEM it runs itself and thinks for you
epicurus
RJarett, isnt learning that part of the cert process though
RJarett
not really
epicurus
instetad of claiming it, i can actually have proof i know what the fu*k i'm doing
RJarett
Being able to be level headed in a disaster and having experienced it in your own environment, you will be far ahead other people
lol
oca as proof
thats funny
epicurus
but you're assuming again
RJarett
do you realize how mickey mouse that cert is?
epicurus
you assume the cert is proof that someone doesnt know what they're doing?
that is sort of retarded, man
don't be an elitist as****e
you're just a guy on irc
let me ask you this
is it possible that someone who gets the cert might actually know what they're doing
RJarett
A former oracle employee, and current systems engineer with many vldb pushing hundreds of thousands of transactions a second
epicurus: not until 4-5 years after the cert when they get real experience
epicurus
ok
that actually makes sense
because the job ads i see often ask for that much experience
but tell me this...
how does anyone get 5 yrs exp if you NEED 5 yrs exp to get a job?
RJarett
you need to do bi**hwork a while and work your way into it
epicurus
i never said my plan would make me an expert.. .but HAVING a plan is important, and following through, right?
RJarett
databases are the heartblood of a company
companies shouldnt let any dumbass touch them
and oca is as junior level as they come
epicurus
so its a chicken and egg scenario
you're a dumbass until you have done it 5 years
but you can't get a job without 5 yrs
RJarett
you can
you just need to start at the bottom
epicurus
what do you mean by that, though
i mean, i never expected to start at the top
but i don't need to do monkey work
RJarett
if you say so
epicurus
RJarett, nobody is going to sit there and hold my hand
we learn things ourselves
thatsme
can anyone help a complete newb. trying to insert and keep getting ORA-00911: invalid character
RJarett
thatsme: provide background to the situation
thatsme
rjarett: I have a table called EMP_1 created and I'm trying to insert "INSERT INTO EMP_1 VALUES('101','News','John','G','11/8/2000','502');"
rjarett: Should I post the table structure??
epicurus
RJarett, i figured i should go ahead and get the certs along the way, because i'll have to know all that sh*t anyway and at least it will get me interviews
RJarett
thatsme: yeah and if your first and last columns are number type you dont need the ''
what method are you inserting? why are you "" the sql?
thatsme
They are VARCHAR part of an assignment so I didn't play with the table structure that they handed me"EMP_NUM" VARCHAR2(3),
"EMP_LNAME" VARCHAR2(15),
"EMP_FNAME" VARCHAR2(15),
"EMP_INITIAL" VARCHAR2(1),
"EMP_HIREDATE" DATE,
"JOB_CODE" VARCHAR2(3),
"EMP_PCT" FLOAT(8),
"PROJ_NUM" VARCHAR2(2)
)
RJarett
float?
really?
thatsme
Sorry wrong one
"EMP_NUM" CHAR(3),
"EMP_LNAME" VARCHAR2(15),
"EMP_FNAME" VARCHAR2(15),
"EMP_INITIAL" VARCHAR2(1),
"EMP_HIREDATE" DATE,
"JOB_CODE" VARCHAR2(3),
PRIMARY KEY ("EMP_NUM") ENABLE,
CONSTRAINT "JOB_CODE" FOREIGN KEY ("JOB_CODE")
REFERENCES "JOB" ("JOB_CODE") ENABLE
)
thats better
RJarett
im betting its your date
thatsme
thats what I thought but due to limited knowledge got stuck should I try a TO_DATE?
RJarett
insert into emp_1 values ('101', 'News','John','G',to_date('11/8/2000','MM/D/YYYY','502');
may be d not D
thatsme
RJARRET: thanks the to-date needed to_date('11/8/2000','MM/DD/YYYY')
8 isn't a valid day of the week
epicurus
RJarett, let me ask you something when you are done here
do you think most shops have a place on the payroll for a guy to sit around and watch the dba expert
RJarett
epicurus: shut the fu*k up and go away
and yeah, its called the CIO
epicurus
why so hostile?
RJarett
Im sure your 'tier 1' university prepared you for the job market
go have fun as a dba specialist
epicurus
i was in the job market before i went to university
if you knew sh*t you would know university is not a trade school
RJarett
lol
It's just another worthless piece of paper like a cert is
epicurus
so you have no education?
RJarett
I didnt say that
epicurus
so your education was worthless?
RJarett
But the education I value the most has no paper associated
epicurus
oh, street smarts
RJarett
Hands on and real world experience
epicurus
i have both
RJarett
One funny thing at oracle, all tech notes on metalink and before metalink were reviewed by dumbfu*k non technical people from yale and princeton, other ivy leagues. Masters/PHD english majors. And these dipsh*ts would revoke or remove technotes and howtos because if spelling or grammar
I always found that fitting of formal education
epicurus
so education and professional certifications are for dipsh*ts
makes sense
RJarett
Yeah pretty much
any idiot can get oca and ocp
all you have to do is pay the class tax
epicurus
then why do all the jobs ads require a 4 year degree and certifications?
are they dipsh*ts too?
RJarett
Because HR people have no technical knowledge
epicurus
they get the requirements from the department
they don't make that sh*t up
but let's not argue this
Xgc
epicurus: Because most companies/management and even most technical employees are not capable of evaluating technical fitness.
epicurus
well goddamn
i'll fit right in
RJarett
lockheed used to require 10+ years and a masters for a web developer only doing html work
epicurus
ok ok
Xgc
So they depend on useless documents about useless degrees.
epicurus
so we agree the job requirements are ridiculous
i'm not really concerned with whether degrees are worthless or not.... the fact is they are on the job requirements
RJarett
In my job description,it even listed I had to be able to lift 80 pounds
epicurus
80 pounds of bullsh*t
RJarett
But that doesnt mean some weight lifter should apply if they are a big idiot
and even if it was a weight lifting job, i wouldnt hire someone that had a paper saying they could
epicurus
lol
RJarett
I would make them prove it
epicurus
point taken
but there are no oracle apprentice jobs listed
RJarett
jr sys admin
helpdesk
etc
epicurus
i've already done that sort of sh*t, i didn't touch any oracle there
RJarett
Then you had no initiative
Or couldnt work yourself into that role, nor could you prove you had the ability to be trusted with it
epicurus
no, i had other sh*t to do
RJarett
And?
Cry me a river
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