logs archiveIRC Archive / Freenode / #firefox / 2010 / March / 26 / 1
EGreg
hey guys in FF, can I write debugger;
to drop into debug mode?
mtx_init
in linux for thunderbird how do I just backup my account, so I can add it to a new install?
Peng
Copy ~/.thunderbird or ~/.mozilla-thunderbird?
TannerF
its /.mozilla/thunderbird, iirc
mar77i
hey, mwup / mwdown redraw is scrambled... is this a known issue? also, the flash areas show cursor:pointer and I got to bypass it with holding mmb... fun hack, but still :(
Ferrenrock
hello
TannerF
hi
Peng
sup
Ferrenrock
hey, I'm having problems with webmail
like, I can't compose or view mail
         

TannerF
what client?
Ferrenrock
I know it's probably microsoft being difficult with proprietary protocols, but is there some workaround for this?
TannerF: what do you mean?
it's on xubuntu
TannerF
hotmail
?
yahoo? roundcube?
Ferrenrock
ah, nevermind
I'm trying to get my parents to use linux
and my mom was having trouble getting to her work mail
but I just changed some stuff and it worked
apparently IE autoresolves webmail@example.com to webmail.example.com
and she was typing it with an @ symbol
it doesn't work in firefox
TannerF: they keep getting crap in XP, I'm having them try this out
they just need a word processor, email, web browser, printer
I got everything else working
WormFood
is there any way to make FF select the user's selected language under winblows? Like Office (for example) does, with the right language packs are installed. It is rather frustrating to have to install 2 localized copies of FF on the same machine.
wow, it looks like my question killed the channel
Peng
You can install language pack XPIs. Dunno if Windows hates them or something, though.
I'm not sure if Mozilla makes them available for all languages either.
WormFood
well, what I want is the 2nd most popular language on the internet
GarrettW
chinese?
WormFood
ù
GarrettW
(Action) cannot see that character
WormFood
GarrettW, did you know that off-hand, or did you look it up?
GarrettW
knew it off-hand
WormFood
I said "correct"
GarrettW
ah
WormFood
duì
GarrettW
all i saw was a square box
WormFood
I can do that too  ¡
auscompgeek
(Action) pats his ChatZilla
WormFood
auscompgeek, it has less to do with your client, and more to do with having the right fonts installed
most irc clients support utf-8
GarrettW
i used to use chatzilla a few years ago, but i'm on x-chat now
         

WormFood
me too GarrettW...I've been using x-chat for over a decade
auscompgeek
XD
WormFood
hell, I've been on irc since 1994
auscompgeek
btw, no one saw my IP, right?
WormFood
I see your IP
it is 127.0.0.1
right?
GarrettW
haha
btw i was 6 years old in 1994 -- we didn't even have a computer at that time
WormFood
I bought my first computer in 1986, and my first modem in 1985
the computer I was using had a modem, and it got struck by lightning (I lived in the lightning capital of the world), and so I bought a new modem to replace it....it was a nice direct-connect modem, so acoustic adapter crap....but not auto-dial...so I'd have to pick up the phone, dial, wait for carrier, and hit the 'on-line' button, then hang up the phone
so=no
back in the bad old days
GarrettW
hehe
WormFood
it was a blazing 300 baud too
I can type that fast, I think
GarrettW
and i bet you were all about the BBSes
auscompgeek
WormFood XD
WormFood
BTW, they STILL use 110 baud today
GarrettW
what? how? where?
WormFood
of course, that is all there was...access to the internet was through some people's work places
GarrettW, TTY, for deaf people
auscompgeek
(Action) is busy reading web pages
GarrettW
oh
WormFood
you can use 110 baud anywhere...even phone booth
and what a lot of people don't know, is that 1200 bit rate modem, was still 300 baud....it just had 4 bits per baud, instead of 1 (I think that is technically correct)
GarrettW
lol i'll have to look up the difference between a bit and a baud
WormFood
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gross_bit_rate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baud
Because people misuse the term "baud" so frequently, many do not know there is a difference between "bit rate" and "baud rate". I use the term "baud rate" knowing it is wrong, so people would be able to find this page, when searching the web.
GarrettW
right
i knew there was a difference but i didnt know what exactly
WormFood
yeah, it can be a little confusing at first, but really is easy to understand once you learn it
the bell 212 standard (as opposed to the bell 202 standard) used FSK (Frequency Shift Keying)...basically they used 4 different frequencies...to transmit/receive a 0/1, so it can be full duplex (bell 202 is 1/2 duplex, and is still used today, as odd as that may sound)
the 1200 baud modem used a combination of methods on each baud, to give it more possible changes...sorta like mixing AM and FM on the same frequency
actually, if I remember correctly, the 1200 used PSK (Phase Shift Keying), but I could be wrong on that
auscompgeek
This is getting a bit off topic.
GarrettW
haha yeah it is. WormFood, what? half-duplex is still in use??
WormFood
yes, very much so....on radio ;) (I was also a ham operator)....think "packet radio"
clever
ive heard something about ATM machines using 110 baud
and something about it working even over a peice of wet string
WormFood
clever, that would not surprise me, as they really don't have much data to send...but I had not heard that before
clever
with rs-232, baud is the 'bit rate'
and there is normaly 1 start bit, 8 data bits, and 1 stop bit
so 10 raw bits per byte of actual data
the bus idle's 'high' (+12?), the start bit is low (-12?), then the data, and stop bit (high again)
the start bit gives the receiver something to sync to, and then he goes purely on an internal clock, set for the same baud
though i havent memorized how dialup works yet
WormFood
you mean bit rate, not baud rate
baud is on the analog side of things
the digital side is all bit rate
clever
a 115200 baud setting on the serail port means 115200 raw bits on the wire, per second
WormFood
they're using the term "baud" incorrectly there
clever
http://hackaday.com/2009/05/27/1964-300baud-modem-surfs-the-web/ this was a fun post to read
WormFood: ive always seen it called baud in every terminal app ive used
let me check again
WormFood
right....incorrectly too
clever
minicom calls it Bps
WormFood
because many times the bit rate and the baud rate are the same, but not always....so people get the terms confused
bits per second
clever
checking putt
y
putty just called is 'speed'
where did i see it, lol
WormFood
even more generic
clever
ok, hyperterminal
bits per second!!!
lol
maybe i'm just remembering it wrong
did you read that link i posted?
WormFood
probably...but you also probably did see it somewhere
yes, I read it
interesting
clever
the modem is so old, that the r/c ocsilator for its core freq's, is based on the serial port voltages
and modern computers cheap out and dont use -12v and +12v
WormFood
that is pretty sad
most don't
but the max-232 can still generate -10v/+10v
clever
most of what i deal with today is 0/5v or 0/3.3v
WormFood
the max-232 is an rs-232 line converter chip that runs off a single +5v supply
clever
yeah ive looked at it
WormFood
yeah, most serial ports are screwed up, in respect to the rs-232 standard
clever
mine is more complex
0/5v serial hits a xbee explorer regulated, which cuts the voltage down to 3.3
then it hits a xbee serial radio
which broadcasts it at 2.4ghz
a 2nd one picks it up and sends it out at 0/3.3v serial
which enters a 0/3.3v usb serial port
it can also perform bit rate conversions seamlessly
i was recently proding at my scope today with it connected to the tv out on my pc
i can easily make out the b&w brightness levels
WormFood
you have an oscilloscope?
clever
yeah
WormFood
what bandwidth?
clever
100mhz DSO
WormFood
nice!
clever
its maybe a decade old
CRT display
WormFood
my old one, from back in the days I did electronics repair (late 80s/early 90s) was only 30 Mhz
clever
expansion card for connecting to a pc or plotter
WormFood
but now I have a "new" one, that I want to say is 40Mhz
but those are on the other side of the world from me now
clever
hackaday recently had a post on converting a 50mhz pure digital scope (LCD panel), to 100mhz
basicaly, you just replace 1 SMD capacitor
WormFood
interesting
clever
and the cost of the thing will jump over 100$
WormFood
cost or value?
clever
buying a 100mhz scope from the store/site will cost you 100$ more then the 50mhz version
when the only difference is a single cap and the stickers
WormFood
that cap didn't cost $100
clever
but a 100mhz scope has more 'value'
WormFood
so, you're saying the value will jump $100
not cost :P
clever
if the demand for 50mhz scopes goes up, they just stick a diff cap in and sell it for half price
same kind of thing happens with CPU's
WormFood
yep
I remember the older AMD CPUs, you could use a bit of conductive paint to jumper it to go faster
because they are bin sorted for speed
clever
i think that trick was modifing the resistance of the r/c clock system
thats what i remember
WormFood
it is not like they make a 500MHz and 600Mhz CPU...they make a cpu and test it at 500Mhz, and label it as such...and test another one from the same bin at 600Mhz, and label it as such
clever
yeah
if the quality on the cpu is crappy
it performs horidly at high speeds (messes up)
WormFood
I remember I took a P120, and overclocked it to 180, and it ran solid all day long...no problems
clever
so they just underclock it until it works right
i remember taking my 1.6ghz desktop, and turning the speed up 1 notch in the bios
not even 2%
the hdd went tits up and it never booted from that disk again:P
WormFood
I remember I had a cyrix cpu ('486 compatible), that overheated (wire got stuck in the cpu fan), and after that, I had to underclock it to make it work at all
clever
ive got a old redhat server here (i forget the cpu), 64mb ram
WormFood
I had a bad power supply output 10V on the 12V line, and it burned up my HD
clever
the cpu fan kept blowing its bearings
one day, i notice its too silent
fan is stuck:P
GarrettW
:o
clever
so i just ssh'd in and shut it down
WormFood
yeah...seen that more times than I can count
clever
doesnt appear to have been damaged at all
and it doesnt even have thermal grease on it
there is another 486 (or 386?) i have downstairs id like to get running
it doesnt even have a bloody heatsink!!
and it doesnt have a floating point core either :P
GarrettW
yup i had a 486DX back in the day
clever
so that makes it an SX
WormFood
I had the boss's wife come into my work area on day, and ask if that fan noise (wobbly fan blades) bothered me...and I said something to the effect that it comforted me, because then I know the fan is still running ;)
clever
i tried to rune duke nukem on it one day
not enough ram
so ive got my scope set to 5us/division, and i can clearly see the test patern from the tv
the first few columns of pixels (solid white/black) look as expected
then it just starts turning into high freq noise
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Multiburst.jpg
this one
ah the description on the wiki explains why i see sine waves of increasing freq
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